From Court to Cosmos: J. Leonard Costner’s Pivot from Pro Sports to Epic Fantasy

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[SPEAKER_00]: listeners of the randomness of nothing podcast is your host Rashad Woods and with a special guest today, I'm very honored with the opportunity to be able to talk to an author, former athlete, and with a really acclaimed series that you're going to want to hear more about.

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[SPEAKER_00]: This is Jordan Leonard Costner, J. Leonard Costner, that does the legacy series.

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[SPEAKER_00]: And this is a heck of a series I'm looking for for my copy of his book coming in the mail.

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[SPEAKER_00]: How you doing, sir?

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[SPEAKER_00]: Thank you for being on the show.

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[SPEAKER_01]: Hey, I'm duo.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Well, Rashad, I appreciate you having me.

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[SPEAKER_00]: I'm excited to talk to you.

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[SPEAKER_01]: Um, her.

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[SPEAKER_00]: great things about the show listen to a couple of samples so you know i'm looking forward to to our chat i'm pumped you know and i've always like this had a special place for me because i'm such a big fan of creativity when you mentioned like when your inspiration was Spartacus and i automatically started thinking of obviously that legendary film

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[SPEAKER_00]: with Kirk Douglas, and I think of Gladiator, and all those wonderful, really Scott movies, and all the epic films that came up with Charlton has to grow it up.

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[SPEAKER_00]: So tell us about your inspiration from writing, and really how you came up with this concept.

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[SPEAKER_01]: So I mean, my writing process is a little bit different than everybody else's.

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[SPEAKER_01]: Most people will come up with an idea say, hey, I want to be a writer, I want to write the story.

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[SPEAKER_01]: For me, my whole story and the series stem from ego death and from,

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[SPEAKER_01]: a dream that I had, and a previous life, I played high level basketball, I was MBA draft prospect, and my senior year of college, my leg disconnected.

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[SPEAKER_01]: So I had to have my leg reattached and my pelvis reconstructed, um, but then that was a year recovery and, uh, the after post surgery, uh, for 30 nights in a row.

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[SPEAKER_01]: I had the same exact dream and the same dream re-accured every night.

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[SPEAKER_01]: uh... verbatim and ended up jotting that down now mind you don't go to eagle death at this point because you know teeter recovery uh... orthos tell me that you're never be able to play basketball again but that was my identity that you know i had sacrificed for so long for blood for you know yeah for some

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[SPEAKER_00]: It was ripped away from you.

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[SPEAKER_00]: It was just taken away.

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[SPEAKER_01]: It ripped away.

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[SPEAKER_01]: It's, you know, it's a life that was ripped away and you had to mourn that life, you know, even, you know, even at that point, I'm not thinking anything of it because that's my the only identity that I know.

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[SPEAKER_01]: But ended up jotting down this, this, this dream that I was having and it turned into my first book.

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[SPEAKER_01]: beautiful.

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[SPEAKER_01]: And I wasn't a writer, I was a graphic art major, and I approached it in a way that felt familiar to me, so I decided to write as a different medium, you know, as opposed to using like pencil or watercolor or acrylic something like that, I decided to use words as a different

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[SPEAKER_01]: And people tell me that this book in this series is the closest thing that they have to watch me moving.

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[SPEAKER_00]: I've always, you know, I think sometimes, you know, especially in this era where there's so many visuals that are available to people, I say it's respectfully like something has to grasp people immediately because they immediately want to see something, like, you know, they say the old saying, like you have to catch somebody's attention, like two seconds later on social media before it goes.

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[SPEAKER_00]: So like, when you can visualize something reading and it takes you to that place, there's something special about that, right?

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[SPEAKER_00]: Because if you look at the old novels of, you know, princess of Mars and, you know,

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[SPEAKER_00]: the really the first sci-fi space opera kind of book right you know that's before George Lucas people who are listening for star wars right and then you start visualizing these places and you're like wow and you know it takes you to places that you never imagined did you have a previous background in writing anything as a kid I know you said your graphic arts major but did it just come out organically while you were you know compartmentalizing such a

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[SPEAKER_01]: Like, all people do, you know, try, you know, jotting down poems, things like that.

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[SPEAKER_01]: But, you know, just in terms of writing, it wasn't ever anything that I kind of focused on.

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[SPEAKER_01]: You know, for me, it's all, my dad was a professional basketball player.

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[SPEAKER_01]: I was born in that life.

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[SPEAKER_01]: I grew up, I was raised in Europe, you know.

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[SPEAKER_01]: watching him play and he never told me how to be a basketball player that's just what I knew exactly.

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[SPEAKER_01]: So, you know, when I decided to start writing it, something interesting happened and it kind of probably plays into something that the belt further.

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[SPEAKER_01]: more recently, but for me words have colors.

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[SPEAKER_01]: And each word is a different, it has a different cone-side in colors.

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[SPEAKER_01]: So as I'm writing, I kind of tell people like, you know, apologize if you're expecting like, you know, JK Rowling or George R. Martin or James Peterson.

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[SPEAKER_01]: like, that's not me.

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[SPEAKER_01]: This is going to be a different read than what you might be used to, but for me words have colors and as I'm writing, the colors have to match or they have to coincide with, you know, I see all of my, I have synesthesia.

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[SPEAKER_01]: So I foresee all of my story

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[SPEAKER_01]: as I'm writing, the color has turned into a brush stroke.

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[SPEAKER_01]: And it's, you know, it has to flow and effort.

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[SPEAKER_01]: There's no answer to words, right?

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[SPEAKER_00]: There's no answer to that.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, right, you know, because it's weird, like, you know, we both, I don't know what music you listen to, but you know how there's the filler songs on the albums, right?

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[SPEAKER_00]: And you're like,

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[SPEAKER_00]: Okay, so you try to take away like the, you know, they have to make sure that they met the album, you know, the contractual agreement of 12, you know, the album, so they got four songs that you're just like skip, skip, skip, skip, no skip, you know, skip, skip, skip, skip, skip, skip, skip, skip, skip, skip, skip, skip, skip, skip, skip, skip, skip, skip, skip, skip, skip, skip, skip, skip, skip, skip, skip, skip, skip, skip, skip, skip, skip, skip, skip, skip, skip, skip, skip, skip, skip, skip, skip, skip, skip, skip, skip, skip, skip, skip, skip, skip, skip, skip, skip, skip, skip, skip, skip, skip, skip, skip, skip, skip, skip, skip, skip, skip, skip, skip, skip, skip, skip, skip, skip, skip, skip, skip, skip,

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[SPEAKER_00]: We've all been there, right?

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[SPEAKER_00]: Exactly.

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[SPEAKER_00]: That's funny.

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[SPEAKER_00]: That I figured I'd throw that little jab in there.

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[SPEAKER_00]: So tell us about the main of the details of the book, Legacy, Blue Card.

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[SPEAKER_00]: I really want to make sure we talk about the plot of it without giving too much away at the same time.

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[SPEAKER_01]: No, you're absolutely here.

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[SPEAKER_01]: So the story follows the young main name, Blue Card, who...

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[SPEAKER_01]: goes off to college.

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[SPEAKER_01]: He's already Brad.

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[SPEAKER_01]: He ends up getting into trouble while he's over in Europe and has to come back to the states and we'll need back in America.

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[SPEAKER_01]: He ends up going to college and discovering that he is the reincarnation spirit for the incarnation of Spartacus.

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[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, so he ends up being pulled into this claimed essence of society called legacy.

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[SPEAKER_01]: This has been thriving since the decline of the Roman Empire, created by Emperor Numerian before assassination.

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[SPEAKER_01]: This institution really thrives in the shadows and you come to find out that legacy is where the world turns.

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[SPEAKER_01]: the handshakes, the bets, the things that happened at this bubble.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, it sounds real good.

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[SPEAKER_01]: Of course, yeah, you know, the things that happened within this bubble that, you know, it's ancient style of combat, but also seen as barbaric in some cases, right, it takes place within this glass sphere, only the wealthy elite have access to, and

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[SPEAKER_01]: as Luke goes on, he realizes that his being here isn't coincidental.

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[SPEAKER_01]: Is that something that he happened to stumble onto?

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[SPEAKER_01]: It's more of a pre-ordained destiny that he has to fulfill not because

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[SPEAKER_01]: God, like, you know, it's a lineage situation.

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[SPEAKER_01]: It's a lineage situation.

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[SPEAKER_01]: It's a lineage, exactly.

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[SPEAKER_01]: He's there because of a blood feud by the man, by the descendant of the man who was commissioned to kill Spartacus.

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[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.

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[SPEAKER_00]: You know what's great about those things is like, you know, I already see the movie playing out of my head, right?

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[SPEAKER_00]: And what's interesting is that, you know, I'm a big, like, highlander, and even though, like, Spartacus, and come a huge, and I immediately started thinking of like, highlander, like, the column, the clam, the clam, the making a brand new make up, and obviously with Henry Capwell, I'm really excited

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[SPEAKER_00]: It's the director of John Wick, right?

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[SPEAKER_01]: So you're like, okay, if it was anybody else on the camera, I thought Carl Urban did a good job.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, you know, yeah, it's a, I'm looking forward to the opportunity to see that film, right?

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[SPEAKER_00]: Because I'm thinking like, you know, I love those.

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[SPEAKER_00]: There's something about, you know, ancient history and it's correlation to modern history, right?

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[SPEAKER_00]: Even when you talk about the gladiator spectacles when you're talking about the,

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[SPEAKER_00]: of the barbaricism, right?

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[SPEAKER_00]: You have the old Greek style of pancreation, right, which was boxing, wrestling, and striking at the same time.

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[SPEAKER_00]: And that's modern day and the May, right?

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[SPEAKER_00]: So all that did was just evolve over the course of time.

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[SPEAKER_00]: to eventually, you know, it's, we're not too dissimilar from what entertain us back then versus what entertains us now.

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[SPEAKER_01]: Absolutely, absolutely not.

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[SPEAKER_01]: And I think, you know, because there is this idea of class and barberism and, you know, we try to separate ourselves from, you know, people of ancient time because we're so much more enlightened, you know, we, we don't do that stuff anymore.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Right?

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[SPEAKER_00]: You know, I'm doing those kind of things.

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[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.

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[SPEAKER_01]: Well, a lot of people will tap into what we see from like, you know, films like Gladiator and, you know, Spartacus on stars and things like that is that people are still drawn to these forms of combat where

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[SPEAKER_01]: If you're deciding your fate between another person, who the question is, you can, you have to do that.

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[SPEAKER_01]: You have to be able to make that choice up close and personal and not from a distance.

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[SPEAKER_01]: You know, not with, you know, weapons of mass destruction or what guns, you know, they're there.

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[SPEAKER_01]: You know, not for nothing, they're lame, you know, forms of killing.

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[SPEAKER_01]: You know, like, oh, you know, wow, you're a big tough guy.

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[SPEAKER_01]: You can shoot somebody from a mile away.

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[SPEAKER_01]: Like, if you want to take somebody's life, you know, and that's kind of what the whole premise is, it's like, Luke has to, he quickly learns that he, his means of survival is an obligation rather than left up the chance.

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[SPEAKER_00]: I think one of the fascinating parts too is him, you know, he's a college student, he's a regular person and he has to navigate this suddenly, you know, life all through moment and then there's that question of, man, I don't know if I'm, does it transport him in time or is it, does it modernize itself?

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[SPEAKER_00]: have periods in that time period, or people transport or anything like that?

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[SPEAKER_01]: That's actually a great question.

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[SPEAKER_01]: So there isn't any time travel in that regard, right?

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[SPEAKER_01]: It's more of a lived human foundation rather than, you know,

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[SPEAKER_00]: Where he has to write a wrong from a different.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.

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[SPEAKER_01]: Exactly.

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[SPEAKER_01]: It's genetic memory.

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[SPEAKER_01]: It's, you know, him tapping into this energy, you know, energy can't be created or destroyed only transfer.

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[SPEAKER_01]: It's him tapping into this energy and there's all these, you know, accounts that we see of people being able to speak.

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[SPEAKER_01]: to or have these you know extra sensory you know perceptions yes kind of the basis of what he is these and echo all so in legacy all the fighters who grace to sand are called Bloodborne's and there's a

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[SPEAKER_01]: some bloodborne have a stronger connection to their origins.

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[SPEAKER_01]: So Luke's origin is Spartacus, and he's an echo because he's essentially the reincarnation of Spartacus.

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[SPEAKER_01]: So he has the ability to tap into his generic memory, as well as

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[SPEAKER_01]: Spartacus' memories, so he's showing them things that, you know, yes, the place before, and he can, you know, kind of rewrite history, because the history always repeats itself, right?

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[SPEAKER_01]: Of course.

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[SPEAKER_01]: So Luke taps into this, you know, side of them, and really this is a different protagonist, and you might see anywhere else.

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[SPEAKER_01]: because it's not him either saying, hey, I'm too powerful.

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[SPEAKER_01]: I don't want to be this person or trying to deny his, you know, abilities or, you know, having a hard time coping with, oh, I'm, you know, such a shudget.

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[SPEAKER_01]: He's an armoured, he's studied, you know, martial arts.

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[SPEAKER_01]: Of course, he has an inclination for combat.

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[SPEAKER_01]: And now the only thing that he isn't able to do is fight with the sword because that's not something that he would have been with.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Correct, right, those are the times that it's an updated skill set.

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[SPEAKER_00]: So to speak when it comes to, you know, exactly.

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[SPEAKER_01]: It's a it's a more of a calling young Study on, you know, integrated in ego where he has to become more burst at being just as, you know, capable of evil as he is a good and the more he becomes heroic, the darker he actually gets.

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[SPEAKER_00]: well it's interesting right because you know some of the most you know acclaimed you know people in history that we kind of just you know say oh you know and I'm not here to judge history in that regard but there's a lot of bodies that they left behind for for what they did you know

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[SPEAKER_00]: We can talk about this for multitudes of times, but, you know, it's, you know, the, the scourge of what they left behind ultimately the Victor gets to tell their stories, right?

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[SPEAKER_00]: And so they get to tell their stories, they get to tell their story, right?

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[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, right, right.

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[SPEAKER_00]: And so they get the statues built after them and it looked like they, you know, conquered the cortical savages and there's a lot of brutality behind it.

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[SPEAKER_00]: You know, but, you know, again, you know, that's how history kind of, you know, ultimately tells itself.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Now, how many books have been written so far?

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[SPEAKER_00]: Seven.

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[SPEAKER_00]: I thought I saw seven and so on.

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[SPEAKER_01]: Seven and seven books.

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[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, the first one, so I was one of the first book was written in 2011, 2012, I published it and then I actually, for some reason, end up writing in teams.

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[SPEAKER_01]: So the second and third books I wrote at the same time and completed both of those in three months and then I wrote

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[SPEAKER_01]: four or five at the same time as well.

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[SPEAKER_01]: And then six, I'm actually actually finished after seven because seven is three times as long as my longest book.

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[SPEAKER_01]: Wow.

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[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Wow.

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[SPEAKER_00]: That's amazing.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Do you do you when you're writing do you feel is like if you get writers block Is that a cliche or is it really difficult like you're writing about particularly about the same character or do you find it that There's still more to tell about this particular character.

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[SPEAKER_00]: There's still more along way But how does that work when you're so in depth with this particular character?

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[SPEAKER_01]: So it's actually interesting So I do get writers block, but not in terms of not knowing what to say it's more of I have too much

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[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.

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[SPEAKER_01]: So for me, the story has been, is all transmission, right?

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[SPEAKER_01]: I'm receiving them, essentially been channeling this entire story since that whole ego death experience.

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[SPEAKER_01]: And,

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[SPEAKER_01]: I don't plan anything out.

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[SPEAKER_01]: If whenever I start writing, I just start writing and then when I'm done, I'm done.

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[SPEAKER_01]: So I'm receiving story and it's, you know, being told to me and if I'm, I'll get a block if there's too much that I have to say, and I'm like, all right, hold on.

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[SPEAKER_01]: Let me figure out what this is, what this means, because I can't have all this stuff and it might be multiple things from different points.

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[SPEAKER_01]: of the story at the same time.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Do you, uh, no, you have, you look like you're also have like, and I want to obviously let any genies on the bottle, but how is it going as far as from being a writer to potentially getting this adapted?

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[SPEAKER_01]: It is, so I think, I think, well,

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[SPEAKER_01]: And I said this on different on another podcast a couple of weeks ago, if you're trying to decide on where you want to go with whatever you're doing, especially with writing, there's a certain point where you kind of need to start tailoring, you know, what you're writing and the avenues you're pursuing.

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[SPEAKER_01]: in order to get there, right?

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[SPEAKER_01]: A lot of us, we don't have unlimited means of resources to just throw money at things.

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[SPEAKER_01]: So if you want to be like a traditional publisher or something like that, like you have to go down to those steps.

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[SPEAKER_01]: If you see it as being more visual than or an audio book, like you can start tailoring.

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[SPEAKER_01]: how you want to do that.

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[SPEAKER_01]: And now with all the different, you know, amenities available to us, like we can be our own publishers.

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[SPEAKER_01]: Absolutely.

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[SPEAKER_01]: I actually ended up creating my own publishing company for this after I had a deal with a traditional publisher.

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[SPEAKER_01]: And that fell through, I didn't decide to pursue it any further.

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[SPEAKER_01]: And I was like, hey, I have the experience,

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[SPEAKER_01]: You know, business wise as well as, you know, creativity and design in order to do this myself, let me just do this myself and at that point it's like you got to keep pushing.

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[SPEAKER_01]: So I've always seen this and experienced this as a visual story and that's how I need to communicate it.

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[SPEAKER_01]: You know, right now it's only, you know, I'm only able to do that, you know, writing I need to keep telling the story, you know, different ways for different people.

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[SPEAKER_01]: You're not going to get there if you know, put yourself an opportunity to grow, you know, what I'm saying is, you know, that also goes to, you know, accepting or rejecting opportunities.

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[SPEAKER_01]: So if you don't put yourself in that position, you know, you're never going to get there.

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[SPEAKER_01]: I, you know, spoiler alert.

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[SPEAKER_01]: I actually am in a position now where we just, you know, we're in a production and development deal with the company LL, um,

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[SPEAKER_01]: Detached to some pretty big names like men and black black Hawk down.

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[SPEAKER_00]: That's amazing.

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[SPEAKER_00]: It's amazing.

17:53.669 --> 17:54.389
[SPEAKER_01]: It's awesome, right?

17:54.769 --> 18:02.530
[SPEAKER_01]: But you know, I've also prior to this when we got the idea of you know, let's just commit to the idea of trying to adapt into a film.

18:02.870 --> 18:07.831
[SPEAKER_01]: I had to go down and put myself in opportunities to, you know, find out what's not right.

18:08.212 --> 18:10.332
[SPEAKER_01]: Of course I can't trust that.

18:10.832 --> 18:13.854
[SPEAKER_01]: You know, you know, you got to learn those, you got to learn those things.

18:13.894 --> 18:19.036
[SPEAKER_00]: And nobody's going to, and the funny part is there's no like, man, you will have to teach you that, right?

18:19.156 --> 18:23.758
[SPEAKER_00]: You can't tap like a friend on the shoulder, but like, hey, man, you're an uncharted territory.

18:23.778 --> 18:27.020
[SPEAKER_00]: You don't mean like, this is you, this is your baby, you got to figure it out.

18:27.720 --> 18:36.985
[SPEAKER_01]: Exactly, you know, it's, you know, okay, I know somebody who does some type of, you know, short story film, you know, like, let me talk to them.

18:37.005 --> 18:38.466
[SPEAKER_01]: They got some sort of experience.

18:38.506 --> 18:40.847
[SPEAKER_01]: I know somebody else who does documentaries.

18:41.207 --> 18:42.768
[SPEAKER_01]: You got to start, you know, doing all this.

18:42.788 --> 18:44.689
[SPEAKER_00]: And you also got to, you know, fall into the predator.

18:44.709 --> 18:45.850
[SPEAKER_00]: So you know, like, oh, man.

18:46.250 --> 19:03.402
[SPEAKER_00]: These things aren't things that I'm comfortable with, you know, for sure, you know, and what I love what you said earlier to when you said you created your own publishing company right so like I do my own podcast right so the barriers have been removed that there's a director who just what back was it back rooms back doors the kids 20 years.

19:03.762 --> 19:31.554
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, 21 years old and just like had the box office leading film and you know now you and then even in the 90s you had the huge brothers right So who did manage the society John Singleton yeah, the barriers Entry to be in media writing podcasting making your own films You know the cost have come down the barriers have come down You know you don't have to wait for that gatekeeper anymore like if you're you want to put music out You're like oh man normally I would have to send my demo now you can sit back and say go on

19:31.994 --> 19:35.195
[SPEAKER_00]: YouTube or SoundCloud and really cultivate your own audience.

19:35.535 --> 19:39.697
[SPEAKER_00]: So for people who are writing or listening or what to be creative, this is the best time to do it.

19:40.337 --> 19:41.257
[SPEAKER_00]: And really, truly, yes.

19:41.577 --> 19:42.798
[SPEAKER_01]: Absolutely, absolutely.

19:42.838 --> 19:47.539
[SPEAKER_01]: You know, with, you know, like Amazon allows you to publish your own stories.

19:47.559 --> 19:49.960
[SPEAKER_01]: There's a bunch of other different, you know, uh...

19:50.500 --> 20:00.657
[SPEAKER_01]: landing pages and websites that let you go in there and do that really it's it comes down to do you have the commitment in order to really see it through as well as

20:02.691 --> 20:05.033
[SPEAKER_01]: know your strong suits.

20:05.253 --> 20:07.996
[SPEAKER_01]: It's fine to not be strong and everything.

20:08.016 --> 20:10.759
[SPEAKER_01]: That's where you got to be able to build a team.

20:10.799 --> 20:19.607
[SPEAKER_01]: You got to be able to build a team and have a, have a, have a, have a, have a, have a, have a, have a, have people that you can trust that can, you know, let you focus on if you're just a creative person.

20:19.667 --> 20:20.868
[SPEAKER_01]: Just write creative person.

20:21.128 --> 20:46.998
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, it's funny you mentioned that right because you know, I do the podcast right and I'm terrible at social media So you have to you know right or promoting things right because you're sitting back and saying I'm to your point you're good at one thing or competent in one thing and you feel comfortable doing another thing Now you have to actually put it out there have you done like book tours signings and you know like to get to really like the PR work and everything going on right now

20:47.238 --> 20:51.001
[SPEAKER_01]: So, this is actually pretty funny, too.

20:51.021 --> 20:57.247
[SPEAKER_01]: I didn't actually start openly publicizing the book until 2023.

20:59.132 --> 21:02.254
[SPEAKER_00]: And you wrote your first one in 2012, and you didn't start for the first one.

21:02.274 --> 21:02.934
[SPEAKER_01]: Thanks.

21:02.994 --> 21:04.155
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.

21:04.175 --> 21:20.464
[SPEAKER_01]: So what it came down to is that experience, I had a experience with the first book that I paid somebody who was an editor, slash, and publishing world for years, decades, and he actually

21:21.304 --> 21:49.822
[SPEAKER_01]: essentially stole money from me tried to change my manuscript because he thought it would be better although he didn't realize that there was more stories and there was all these different typos so I was embarrassed and people said it's not me I'm not saying hey I wrote a book like that's not who I am right so I've eventually got comfortable with being able to do it myself

21:50.262 --> 22:05.094
[SPEAKER_01]: and I sent it to the other publisher and we had to deal and I was like all right you know let me just give a full commitment to it all these again all these new just could be timing all these new you know the applications came out that allowed me to put out a better product

22:06.075 --> 22:18.771
[SPEAKER_01]: and in 2023, met Ross and he put some air under my sales and we started starting talking and then I decided to do a test run with daily dose media.

22:19.131 --> 22:21.735
[SPEAKER_01]: I used to be a largest social media partner company in the world.

22:22.395 --> 22:35.949
[SPEAKER_01]: And spent, you know, a few thousand dollars made my partners and had way more success in, you know, that 30 to 60 days that we did this run with them than I even imagined.

22:36.170 --> 22:36.570
[SPEAKER_01]: Beautiful.

22:36.650 --> 22:43.898
[SPEAKER_01]: So that's kind of how, you know, I got to the ability to be in a position to talk to these, uh,

22:44.618 --> 22:54.928
[SPEAKER_01]: movie folks and these producers, you know, just because at that point, I had, you know, data, I had, you know, a full IP of full servers built out, but it is just all time.

22:55.229 --> 23:00.193
[SPEAKER_00]: It's funny you mentioned that because for people who are listening, you're like, you always ask, how can you get in that room?

23:00.273 --> 23:03.076
[SPEAKER_00]: That's like that, like, everybody wants to get in that room.

23:03.176 --> 23:07.901
[SPEAKER_00]: But what you also have to realize too is like, most of us don't have an uncle, a friend,

23:08.281 --> 23:11.023
[SPEAKER_00]: You know, the person that's good and it gets you in that space.

23:11.183 --> 23:19.830
[SPEAKER_00]: So like, well, you know, I say this respectfully and you'll know this, you get in that space by creating something for people wanting to hear, see, taste or touch, right?

23:19.910 --> 23:24.074
[SPEAKER_00]: You're like, okay, I can't get through there by phone call, but I host a podcast.

23:24.254 --> 23:28.777
[SPEAKER_00]: So then I can get access to people that I could normally get access to.

23:29.137 --> 23:33.221
[SPEAKER_00]: You have a book, you people who want to create, you have to have a product.

23:33.241 --> 23:34.822
[SPEAKER_00]: This is a show me world, right?

23:35.122 --> 23:37.184
[SPEAKER_00]: So, I can show you I have a podcast.

23:37.204 --> 23:38.465
[SPEAKER_00]: You can show you have a book.

23:38.906 --> 23:43.570
[SPEAKER_00]: You know, there's people, they get inundated with ideas all the time to try to adapt films.

23:43.610 --> 23:45.712
[SPEAKER_00]: They put the beauty about it.

23:45.792 --> 23:48.575
[SPEAKER_00]: That's their job as to seek out mediums to adapt.

23:48.935 --> 23:52.058
[SPEAKER_00]: You just have to be prepared when that phone call a conversation takes place.

23:52.358 --> 23:52.878
[SPEAKER_01]: Exactly.

23:52.898 --> 23:53.939
[SPEAKER_01]: You got to keep going.

23:53.979 --> 24:01.684
[SPEAKER_01]: You can't let that one know, you know, oh man, for me, I let the one know, you know, derail me for several years.

24:01.724 --> 24:03.985
[SPEAKER_01]: Now I didn't stop working because I kept running.

24:04.005 --> 24:08.628
[SPEAKER_01]: I wrote, ended up writing five books by the time, you know, 2023 came around.

24:08.928 --> 24:09.228
[SPEAKER_01]: Right.

24:09.248 --> 24:11.489
[SPEAKER_01]: So I had a whole universe built out.

24:11.830 --> 24:14.431
[SPEAKER_01]: But you can't, you got to keep going.

24:14.591 --> 24:15.592
[SPEAKER_01]: You're not saying, like,

24:16.172 --> 24:23.074
[SPEAKER_01]: Opportunities aren't going to just manifest and they're not, you know, JK Rowan talked about sending out like 300 query letters.

24:23.394 --> 24:37.897
[SPEAKER_01]: Really, I mean, it's not because she's a terrible writer obviously, it's, you know, because in that world, you either have to be somebody somebody knows, yeah, or somebody famous because nobody wants to sell a product of somebody that they don't know.

24:38.077 --> 24:47.562
[SPEAKER_00]: Hey, listen, you know, it was it, until I started putting myself and then making this podcast, I'm talking to you because I put myself out there, right?

24:47.682 --> 24:48.302
[SPEAKER_00]: Absolutely.

24:48.562 --> 25:05.110
[SPEAKER_00]: And it's like you're getting these good positive things happening and obviously your book is important, but it's really the theme of life, you know, waiting on for an opportunity sitting on your couch while walking back and forth to the fridge, I don't care what you're trying to accomplish it, it's you're not going to get it and you have to be willing to deal

25:07.291 --> 25:26.976
[SPEAKER_00]: Now that they have screening softwares and they have all these things, you can't let that deter you from putting out your material because, you know, what the publisher or the editor wants to see, you know, how many movie deals are books have been passed by people and then turning the monster's hits because the wrong, the person couldn't understand what was in front of them.

25:27.176 --> 25:41.288
[SPEAKER_01]: Exactly, you know, and again, it's, you know, for me, it's, I keep putting out more content having to do with both one because I got to keep telling the story because there's, there's what, eight billion people in the world.

25:41.528 --> 25:44.811
[SPEAKER_01]: All of these aren't going to be able to learn in the same way.

25:45.431 --> 25:56.180
[SPEAKER_01]: And for me, until I get to a point where it's, you know, turning, turning, turning all by itself, like we're doing a good job now, but until it's turning, turning all by itself,

25:56.460 --> 25:59.103
[SPEAKER_01]: I gotta keep telling the story, the work doesn't stop.

25:59.263 --> 26:03.267
[SPEAKER_00]: Right, it's like, you know, it's like UFC is synonymous with MMA.

26:03.587 --> 26:10.013
[SPEAKER_00]: Until you get to where you're clean, or until you get to where you're Steven King, you know, kind of, kind of level.

26:10.854 --> 26:12.516
[SPEAKER_00]: Everybody had the hustle and work.

26:12.596 --> 26:16.760
[SPEAKER_00]: I remember, like, and I was watching old episodes of Colombo, one time on P-Cock.

26:16.880 --> 26:26.325
[SPEAKER_00]: Okay, and then I saw the first one of the episodes was directed by Steven Spielberg, and it was like 72 and I was like, whoa, I was like, oh, I had to do a double take when I saw the end credits.

26:26.345 --> 26:27.366
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm like, are you kidding me?

26:27.546 --> 26:36.250
[SPEAKER_00]: So here's this, the most famous director in the world had to still cut his teeth, you know, making a clumble episode, making a duel, right?

26:36.551 --> 26:44.075
[SPEAKER_00]: You hear the story of Robert Rodriguez, you know, when he made El Mariachi, and he's donating his body to science, and he's doing this low budget film for 10 grand.

26:45.195 --> 26:50.897
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm in, you know, you may have to kind of like be a little embarrassed like they made this to my first product, but it was something.

26:51.057 --> 26:55.338
[SPEAKER_00]: And then people will applaud you for like, hey man, you really did that on your own.

26:55.358 --> 27:02.180
[SPEAKER_00]: There's these conditions, you know, working full-time balance in family, you know, with the right backing, you can take this to the next level.

27:02.400 --> 27:03.001
[SPEAKER_00]: Absolutely.

27:03.141 --> 27:03.581
[SPEAKER_00]: Absolutely.

27:03.721 --> 27:10.683
[SPEAKER_01]: And, you know, for a lot of folks, especially, you know, in business, you know, the difference between an entrepreneur and a small business owner,

27:14.404 --> 27:15.044
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.

27:15.124 --> 27:16.065
[SPEAKER_01]: There's no difference.

27:16.185 --> 27:20.346
[SPEAKER_01]: It's just one, you know, it's a small person or a small team.

27:20.926 --> 27:25.148
[SPEAKER_01]: And until you can get to the consistent success, you're just an entrepreneur.

27:25.188 --> 27:27.449
[SPEAKER_00]: So just keep knowing there's nothing wrong with it.

27:27.749 --> 27:28.409
[SPEAKER_00]: Absolutely not.

27:28.629 --> 27:29.170
[SPEAKER_00]: Absolutely not.

27:29.290 --> 27:31.811
[SPEAKER_00]: And, you know, I'm really looking forward to that book coming in the mail.

27:32.031 --> 27:34.492
[SPEAKER_00]: You know, I love the fact that it's a seven-part series.

27:34.512 --> 27:35.192
[SPEAKER_00]: You know, it's a me.

27:36.032 --> 27:42.335
[SPEAKER_00]: I say this, you know, kind of, biously, I hope they don't chop it into a movie where they take seven books and put it in a like, try to make it into one movie.

27:42.755 --> 27:46.817
[SPEAKER_00]: I hope that it's like many series, and I really do, like, because you're like, that's it.

27:48.157 --> 27:51.158
[SPEAKER_01]: So luckily, I do have some input in that.

27:51.619 --> 27:52.019
[SPEAKER_01]: Okay.

27:52.279 --> 27:56.461
[SPEAKER_01]: Okay, you're also, yeah, we also have a graphic novel that was coming out too.

27:56.621 --> 28:01.023
[SPEAKER_01]: So I'll get you a copy of that, but yeah, they're gonna debut in a comic con.

28:01.683 --> 28:03.584
[SPEAKER_00]: That is awesome, yeah.

28:04.704 --> 28:08.566
[SPEAKER_01]: Outland outland and platinum studios platinum studios are doing it.

28:08.746 --> 28:11.687
[SPEAKER_01]: I'm gonna publish it You know with diamond with diamond classics.

28:11.707 --> 28:20.031
[SPEAKER_01]: That's you know awesome that history right there Yeah, and then we got a pretty dope name with attach to this frame play He's Ryanette.

28:20.111 --> 28:24.533
[SPEAKER_01]: He's also involved with the with the with the graphic novel as well

28:25.253 --> 28:29.236
[SPEAKER_01]: And a claim writer, I don't know if I can give his name away.

28:29.256 --> 28:29.656
[SPEAKER_01]: Don't do it.

28:29.676 --> 28:30.456
[SPEAKER_01]: Let's not do that.

28:30.516 --> 28:31.177
[SPEAKER_01]: Let's not do that.

28:31.217 --> 28:35.719
[SPEAKER_01]: His, his, his, his, his, his graphic now has been a depth into film.

28:35.759 --> 28:38.961
[SPEAKER_01]: He's, uh, we're in a bunch for Marvel and D.C.

28:39.001 --> 28:40.422
[SPEAKER_01]: So this is pretty cool.

28:40.482 --> 28:43.944
[SPEAKER_01]: I'll get, I'll definitely not get you a copy of that graphic novel for sure.

28:44.124 --> 28:49.688
[SPEAKER_00]: And what's most amazing is, is that when you're holding up in the hospital bed, and you're doing rehab, you know, here you are, you know,

28:50.548 --> 28:56.753
[SPEAKER_00]: Years later, over a decade, and that's one thing people also have to understand is that you're 10 years successful overnight in the making.

28:56.773 --> 29:09.102
[SPEAKER_00]: People always see the production deal, or at the film for me, or the TV for me, or whatever you're going to be having your big event, and you let out that side really like damn.

29:09.382 --> 29:17.468
[SPEAKER_00]: I just really didn't see when you were in the hospital bed, you know, with your dreams dashed, you know, wondering what's next in life, you know what I mean?

29:17.628 --> 29:29.255
[SPEAKER_01]: Absolutely, absolutely, you know, and, you know, not for nothing, like it's, I saw it myself as a film and you got to believe in yourself first, the heart of the family.

29:29.575 --> 29:30.916
[SPEAKER_01]: Nobody else is going to believe in you.

29:31.276 --> 29:36.139
[SPEAKER_00]: So you have to believe in yourself first and be able to convince other people to believe me as well.

29:36.319 --> 29:37.260
[SPEAKER_00]: You're not now listening.

29:37.640 --> 29:42.663
[SPEAKER_00]: I have a podcast that actually like has trained in going some traction and all I did, I started it.

29:42.683 --> 29:43.944
[SPEAKER_00]: If you look at my first episode,

29:46.425 --> 29:47.867
[SPEAKER_00]: going to start background.

29:48.708 --> 29:51.733
[SPEAKER_00]: And then next, you know, I got a PR rep in Los Angeles.

29:52.133 --> 29:55.098
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm going to do a National Social Media Awards event.

29:55.158 --> 29:57.601
[SPEAKER_00]: I got a photo shoot that really hills coming up.

29:57.922 --> 30:00.786
[SPEAKER_00]: And it's to your point, you're like,

30:01.507 --> 30:07.672
[SPEAKER_00]: All I had to do was get out of my own head and say, you know what, to heck with it, I'm just gonna see what happens.

30:07.892 --> 30:16.900
[SPEAKER_01]: Exactly, exactly, you start, you start for one point, you get one listener, one listener means 10, 10 means a hundred, and that just keeps compounding.

30:17.380 --> 30:20.263
[SPEAKER_00]: So, you know, for me, I got, you know,

30:20.963 --> 30:38.878
[SPEAKER_01]: very hardcore of very hardcore fan base beautifully with some folks and you know although I may not understand why like the fact that they ride for me so hard means that I'm obligating now to continue to tell the story and to take it as far as I can.

30:39.158 --> 30:57.677
[SPEAKER_00]: it's the same thing with me right you know you're like when people start referring their clients to you you're like oh snap I better be on point like you know to me like you take that serious because you realize like when when PR reps are saying hey I got my client on you know what to come on that means that they don't know you from time bigger Jane they're just trusting what they heard so I can't

30:58.017 --> 31:11.226
[SPEAKER_00]: bomb or have a horrible experience with you, because you're like, hey man, you know, they didn't that leads to a bigger client and I'm not saying, I'm not saying that to you in a negative way, but you have no idea who's listening at any given something.

31:11.246 --> 31:12.186
[SPEAKER_01]: Exactly, exactly.

31:12.247 --> 31:22.473
[SPEAKER_01]: It's all, it's everything is everything is viewed from an outside lens, like you said, nobody saw, you know, nobody saw the hardships, they only see the old nice and such.

31:22.994 --> 31:23.114
[SPEAKER_01]: And

31:24.314 --> 31:30.118
[SPEAKER_01]: to know to expect anybody else but you know it's we only can we only can foresee the world through our eyes.

31:30.358 --> 31:30.718
[SPEAKER_01]: Exactly.

31:30.738 --> 31:40.764
[SPEAKER_00]: So we have to keep putting out we have to keep playing out you know great content we have keep playing out image of somebody that other people want to know who they are.

31:40.784 --> 31:41.425
[SPEAKER_00]: That question.

31:41.445 --> 31:42.365
[SPEAKER_00]: That question.

31:42.385 --> 31:49.329
[SPEAKER_00]: Right and you know the thing is about it is at the end of the day there's a lot of underserved audiences that are craving for that type of

31:50.970 --> 31:54.212
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, so, you know, I think we can have a part two.

31:54.272 --> 31:55.092
[SPEAKER_00]: I'd love to see more.

31:55.192 --> 31:56.913
[SPEAKER_00]: I can't talk about the book.

31:57.373 --> 32:00.794
[SPEAKER_00]: Like I said, actually, I can't wait to see you up with the stars, where you need to be.

32:01.575 --> 32:15.241
[SPEAKER_00]: And, you know, we're connected because when you start, you realize that when you see that there's a there, it's like a weird feeling because you're like am I really actually like somewhat like doing this, right?

32:15.341 --> 32:17.502
[SPEAKER_00]: It's a weird, it's a weird thing because you still have to

32:18.202 --> 32:18.902
[SPEAKER_01]: But we got that.

32:18.942 --> 32:19.983
[SPEAKER_01]: We got to have a part two.

32:20.023 --> 32:21.123
[SPEAKER_01]: I appreciate you having me.

32:21.263 --> 32:22.883
[SPEAKER_01]: We, uh, I'm told.

32:22.923 --> 32:27.225
[SPEAKER_01]: We felt something I have in two, two, three, two, four.

32:27.265 --> 32:29.865
[SPEAKER_01]: We'll know for, for a fact where it was just going to be.

32:29.885 --> 32:30.306
[SPEAKER_01]: Of course.

32:30.326 --> 32:33.687
[SPEAKER_01]: So we'll have, we'll have a, we'll have a with the foot the film with the film of me.

32:33.887 --> 32:34.047
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.

32:34.067 --> 32:34.567
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.

32:34.647 --> 32:35.107
[SPEAKER_00]: Oh, okay.

32:35.147 --> 32:36.187
[SPEAKER_00]: Well, you know, listen, man.

32:36.207 --> 32:41.329
[SPEAKER_00]: You know, I would love to interview you at the premiere at some point when it, when it, I absolutely will.

32:41.349 --> 32:42.409
[SPEAKER_00]: When it comes to do that.

32:42.649 --> 32:43.469
[SPEAKER_01]: What does it do that?

32:43.769 --> 32:44.990
[SPEAKER_00]: Where can people find Jay Leonard

32:45.590 --> 32:53.935
[SPEAKER_01]: So you can actually, if you want to just Google J-Liner Costner at budget SEO comes up, you'll see conversations, you'll be able to find the books.

32:53.995 --> 32:57.537
[SPEAKER_01]: You can go to the legacyverse.com.

32:57.577 --> 33:04.261
[SPEAKER_01]: If you want to see the website, get some more background on the universe of legacy itself.

33:04.461 --> 33:07.243
[SPEAKER_01]: Instagram at the Legacy XI.

33:07.363 --> 33:09.444
[SPEAKER_01]: It was a bunch of content in there.

33:09.764 --> 33:13.667
[SPEAKER_01]: I do a bunch of like VO3 renderings

33:14.387 --> 33:23.669
[SPEAKER_01]: able to tell the story visually that way, you know, you know, people want to kind of get an idea of, you know, what it might look like as a film or have some sort of visual reference to the characters.

33:24.349 --> 33:26.870
[SPEAKER_01]: Again, it's just, I'm constantly telling the story.

33:27.350 --> 33:37.572
[SPEAKER_01]: The work doesn't stop and even after we premiere our first film, that night is going to be to the end credits and then what's next?

33:37.632 --> 33:37.912
[SPEAKER_01]: I got it.

33:37.932 --> 33:40.512
[SPEAKER_00]: Can I just, can I just get a little caveat before we go?

33:44.273 --> 33:54.916
[SPEAKER_00]: The first movie is usually great, and then they rush the second film to get like, you know, like, the piggyback off the first one, and nine times out of ten, the second one's never is good, right?

33:54.996 --> 33:58.716
[SPEAKER_00]: So like, I'm not saying, for every Terminator 2, right?

33:58.736 --> 33:59.577
[SPEAKER_00]: There's a Whitney, right?

33:59.617 --> 34:00.157
[SPEAKER_00]: There's a Whitney, right?

34:00.357 --> 34:04.938
[SPEAKER_00]: There's a Whitney of other films, you know, that we don't need to discuss what happened, and they just agree with that too.

34:05.598 --> 34:18.292
[SPEAKER_01]: I mean, maybe Harry Potter might be the only series franchise where the film's got maybe better, you know, but I mean, we got too many fast figures already.

34:19.528 --> 34:20.889
[SPEAKER_00]: Don't even have it started on that man.

34:21.209 --> 34:23.190
[SPEAKER_00]: Like the first one came out, right?

34:23.210 --> 34:24.631
[SPEAKER_00]: It's like, okay cool.

34:24.651 --> 34:39.720
[SPEAKER_00]: This is a nice little racing film and then when they started going into space and stuff I was like, okay, okay, you know, I'm gonna exit over here or when the guys could they suddenly got like mutant superpowers and they could crack and break like concrete And I'm not hating like it makes money do you know what it's like, you know what man?

34:39.740 --> 34:42.622
[SPEAKER_00]: I think you know for me it just it started getting a little too absurd

34:43.022 --> 34:44.322
[SPEAKER_00]: Right exactly.

34:44.402 --> 34:47.703
[SPEAKER_01]: I mean, I'm still going to watch because I'm interested now.

34:47.723 --> 34:52.284
[SPEAKER_01]: I've been with you folks for a long time I've been doing it 25 26 years.

34:52.324 --> 34:53.725
[SPEAKER_00]: First of all came out in 2000.

34:54.145 --> 34:57.286
[SPEAKER_00]: I was a senior high school I was a senior high school and then moving dry.

34:57.306 --> 34:57.566
[SPEAKER_00]: What?

34:57.906 --> 34:58.966
[SPEAKER_01]: Yes, I was a senior.

34:59.006 --> 35:01.387
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, yeah Yeah, we got to stick with it now.

35:01.407 --> 35:04.427
[SPEAKER_01]: You know, it's been a stable in our lives What?

35:04.527 --> 35:06.728
[SPEAKER_01]: Of course, definitely I'll end this with what what did you do?

35:06.988 --> 35:10.851
[SPEAKER_00]: Well, you know, they kind of aren't winking at the camera while they're making a buck to roll it up.

35:11.011 --> 35:12.512
[SPEAKER_00]: Oh, yeah, but at least one knows what he's like.

35:12.572 --> 35:30.526
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah

35:33.488 --> 35:53.317
[SPEAKER_01]: So absolutely that's really not yeah, he's you know, definitely wanted one to look at you know, and you know, there's so many of you all pretty much a Stanley, you know, Stanley in terms of he's like the goat in terms of, you know, these, you know, the universe's George Lucas, you know, all these folks, you know, started from, you know, feel burned on it.

35:53.337 --> 35:54.798
[SPEAKER_01]: You said a lot of things, you know.

35:55.098 --> 35:59.760
[SPEAKER_01]: modest means they started as just some person trying to break in and they kept at it.

36:00.040 --> 36:08.223
[SPEAKER_00]: Exactly and you know, and I'm looking forward to seeing your name on billboards and looking forward to receiving that book and I've had an absolutely stellar time on the redness and nothing podcast.

36:08.364 --> 36:11.945
[SPEAKER_00]: Like I said, it's fan of fiction and history, blending in all is one.

36:12.385 --> 36:14.266
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm really looking forward to seeing the legacy series.

36:14.506 --> 36:16.047
[SPEAKER_01]: I appreciate you having me, man.

36:16.067 --> 36:18.348
[SPEAKER_01]: This is this is absolute pleasure.

36:18.628 --> 36:19.488
[SPEAKER_01]: Thank you so much.

36:20.148 --> 36:21.009
[SPEAKER_01]: And you know, I'm

36:22.169 --> 36:41.383
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, I'm not I'm not one one to you know, try to say like hey like I'm a black right or nothing like that But seeing folks of color, you know, you know, of course being these positions and of course, you know, like it's To me it means something different to me that does to my grandmother who you know had to go through these things and I

36:42.544 --> 36:43.485
[SPEAKER_01]: just a quick sidebar.

36:43.525 --> 36:52.073
[SPEAKER_01]: I got, you know, published in Amsterdam news, you know, the oldest, you know, black, you know, newspaper in the world, uh, in New York City.

36:52.173 --> 36:56.818
[SPEAKER_01]: And, you know, for me, they had Malcolm X, they had all these, you know, amazing.

36:56.898 --> 36:57.719
[SPEAKER_01]: It's not amazing.

36:58.139 --> 36:58.740
[SPEAKER_01]: It's not amazing.

36:58.760 --> 36:59.140
[SPEAKER_01]: It's amazing.

36:59.781 --> 37:00.461
[SPEAKER_01]: It's amazing.

37:00.521 --> 37:01.042
[SPEAKER_01]: It's amazing.

37:01.062 --> 37:05.346
[SPEAKER_01]: The, the, the handles of, you know, history is that it's, it's amazing.

37:05.826 --> 37:27.242
[SPEAKER_00]: You know, it's one of those things where you sit back and say, I'm supposed to be in this room because a lot of people pay the right you know I have every time I I kind of dismiss my podcast right in a way and but even you see you like I'm supposed to be in this room right and you know you realize that your hard work paid off and you realize that people pay to have your price for you to be able to do this go.

37:27.682 --> 37:32.566
[SPEAKER_00]: And then you don't have to do certain things or go through certain things to be able to get your voice heard.

37:32.706 --> 37:37.930
[SPEAKER_00]: And you kind of said, I can say, well, damn, I have to be successful with that because the barriers have been removed.

37:38.551 --> 37:39.011
[SPEAKER_00]: Exactly.

37:39.211 --> 37:39.612
[SPEAKER_00]: Exactly.

37:39.632 --> 37:41.293
[SPEAKER_01]: This is what they work for.

37:41.313 --> 37:48.819
[SPEAKER_01]: This is what they, you know, we're out here, we're out here, you know, doing and being what they hope that the future would be.

37:49.644 --> 38:10.353
[SPEAKER_00]: Of course, and listen to beauty about it is, is that by putting out your own work, you have more control over it too So hopefully you don't get like the, you know, the treatment where they people would try to modify things Like know this is this is what we agreed upon and this is what it was successful before you tried to adapt it Let's not do certain things because I've already been successful and have a built-in audience

38:11.274 --> 38:17.283
[SPEAKER_01]: Absolutely, listen one more thing for your listeners, trademarks, copyrights, do you need to protect your IP?

38:17.604 --> 38:25.317
[SPEAKER_01]: If you can do that, prior to somebody coming on, you will have more control because nobody can tell you anything with ownership.

38:25.635 --> 38:27.936
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, I've listened to men, the Vultures are real, you know what I mean?

38:27.976 --> 38:34.900
[SPEAKER_00]: So like, you know, I always said that, you know, the nerds with the nerds to the, you know, the venture capitalist guy saw that the nerds made a lot of money, right?

38:35.220 --> 38:38.642
[SPEAKER_00]: Even Comic Con started in a little bank with Hall or something like that, right?

38:38.662 --> 38:40.063
[SPEAKER_01]: They're your way to listen to.

38:40.103 --> 38:40.303
[SPEAKER_00]: Right.

38:40.323 --> 38:40.723
[SPEAKER_00]: Right.

38:40.783 --> 38:41.664
[SPEAKER_00]: That's what I'm saying.

38:41.704 --> 38:45.746
[SPEAKER_00]: So like, when they found out like, oh, you're nerds that are playing, you know, Dungeons and Dragons.

38:45.786 --> 38:46.466
[SPEAKER_00]: Ha ha ha.

38:46.766 --> 38:49.528
[SPEAKER_00]: And then all of a sudden you saw the line of 10,000 people at Whitman.

38:49.909 --> 38:53.565
[SPEAKER_00]: They're there's a there right exactly so you know to me.

38:53.585 --> 38:57.843
[SPEAKER_00]: So J. Leonard Costner, you know, it's been a pleasure and like I said Well, I appreciate it.

38:58.164 --> 38:59.530
[SPEAKER_00]: They look forward to seeing you at the top brother.

38:59.691 --> 39:00.032
[SPEAKER_01]: Thank you sir